When a church focuses on numbers isn’t there a temptation to neglect discipleship?
I like to say that it’s not the business of the church to grow the church. That’s God’s business. Our job is to make disciples. When we do that, the church experiences healthy and dynamic growth. Numbers are important. Every number represents a person precious to God. I will never apologize about a concern for numbers. But it has to be both/and. We want to reach more people and we want to make disciples. They are intertwined.
How do you build a heart in people to love others?
Number one, I think you model it. If you see it, it’s much better than hearing it. A mentor says, “Follow me as I follow Jesus.” I think you do it through challenge as well. You ask, “What is God saying to you, and what are you doing about that?” Jesus lived his life in three dimensions: up with the Father; in with those around him; and out into to the world. So we need a balance of those relational realities. That’s a big part of what it means to disciple and mentor others.
Seacoast was a pioneer in the multisite movement. What is more important, establishing multisites or planting churches?
Again, it’s both/and. You need many expressions of what the church looks like.
What do you mean by many expressions?
Let me tell you about one city: Chattanooga. One of the pastors ARC helped comes from a Pentecostal church background and was a high-energy youth pastor with a lot of young people, and he is doing great. There’s another ARC church there and the pastor is really creative. In fact, his background was film production and he thought he was going to make movies. His church has a more creative vibe. But both churches are doing great and both provide different expressions of the church and appeal to different people. That’s what ARC really is about—changing a city, a state, a nation, the world with different expressions of the body.
So often, though, it seems churches compete with one another instead of complement.
I had a young guy come to me and say he really wanted to plant a church, so I suggested ARC. He said he didn’t know if it was going to work because he wanted to plant a church in Charleston. He hesitated because he knew that Seacoast was already in the city. And I said, “My God, my God, my God, no, no, no, no, no!” Every community needs multiple church plants because there are so many different expressions of the local body. I could make a case that territorialism most generally kills church planting movements.
So does planting 2,000 churches still seem ridiculous?
Was the four-minute mile doable? When someone finally did it, then a whole lot of people believed it was. I’m hoping that’s the case with what we are doing with ARC.
After getting off to such a slow start personally, are you surprised at what God is doing through you?
I’m surprised every day, but now I anticipate. Will we get 2,000 in my lifetime? If we don’t then we are closer to that goal than if we never tried. At the same time, I really believe we will.